Craig Harper's Questions For Humans (LIVE SHOW)

Josh: The Daily Talk Show, episode 311, with our mate Craig Harper.

Craig: Is this all right if I hold it like this? You're happy with that?

Tommy: Yeah, I just had a go at Craig because he wouldn't wear his headphones, and I said, you need to watch out for your mic technique.

Mason: Not—

Craig: how's that?

Tommy: That's even better. That sounds great.

Craig: Josh, Josh will get his bottom lip back in now because he had it hanging out because he went out especially and bought— how much did these cost?

Josh: I can't remember. Oh, there were 185 each. The guy gave us a deal. There were 200 down to 185, so we did okay.

Tommy: Perfect.

Josh: Rode gave us the microphones.

Craig: Thank you, Rode.

Josh: They're an Australian company. This is the first time we've got a live audience.

Craig: Was it 300, 400? What would you say?

Josh: Yeah, he said probably 800. I can't—

Tommy: yeah, give us a bit of a woo. Yeah.

Craig: Wow, fucking hell, that was underwhelming.

Tommy: So where we are is that the Craig Harper HQ.

Craig: There's a straggler up the back there.

Tommy: We've got some stragglers rolling in. I did say before that people probably won't show up because it's free.

Craig: And it's funny how hard it is to get people to something free.

Tommy: Well, you managed to get 750 people to pay.

Mason: Pay?

Craig: And we're struggling.

Tommy: How the fuck are we not getting that many people for something free?

Josh: The only thing that's changed is us two, so that's not a good indication. Anyway, we'll move on.

Tommy: That's good self-awareness though.

Josh: Yeah, Well, we've got Mr. 97 here. Say hi, Mr. 97. How you going?

Craig: Now I know I'm the only person who doesn't know this, and I know it's not my podcast, so I'll shut the fuck up soon. But Mr. 97, because we got a 97 ATAR.

Josh: I did too.

Craig: Fuckin' hell, what? Mr. 32?

Josh: Well, that's exactly right, because Tommy didn't finish high school.

Tommy: So I got zero.

Josh: I got a 46, mainly because I did all arts subjects.

Tommy: He's the smartest kid in the room.

Craig: Did you want to dumb yourself down a bit so you jumped in with these boys?

Josh: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. He wants a little bit of street cred. If he gets into a fight, Tommy can help. Yeah.

Tommy: So, well, it's definitely not you, mate.

Josh: Yeah, absolutely.

Tommy: But what we're doing tonight is we're at your HQ and we're going to talk about your brand new book.

Craig: We are.

Tommy: 20 Questions for Humans by Qualified Human.

Craig: Qualified Human.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: Was there any question that was going to make the book that you ended up cutting? It's a very obvious one, but—

Craig: Nothing that springs to mind. Like, and a lot of these overlap a little bit. And so it was just trying, just trying to cover as broad a spectrum as I could, which covered a little bit in the social, the emotional, the physiological, the practical, the internal stuff, the external stuff to, you know, explore life broadly.

Tommy: For a dummy like me, the experience of reading this book is very great because, you know, when you're reading, you're halfway through a sentence and you forget where you are and you forget what you're even doing, and then I look up and I can see the question that you're writing about at the top. It's bloody brilliant. Does anyone else agree? Yeah. So, um, at the front, I wanted to just cheque in because I haven't seen you in a couple of weeks.

Craig: Sure.

Tommy: Uh, you did a dedication here.

Craig: Sure. Don't read that because I'll cry for sure.

Tommy: No, I loved it. I loved it because you— it's, it's almost like a small emotional roller coaster.

Craig: Well, actually, if you read that, I will then tell you the subsequent story, which—

Josh: oh, this is great.

Tommy: Should I read it?

Josh: I mean, this feels big. Can you write it, read it like it's Audible Presents, a bit of an audio?

Craig: Hang on, I just want to see how many people of the 800 that are here—

Tommy: there's 700 at the back that have rolled in late. You got to come up to the front.

Craig: How many of you have actually read this really?

Tommy: So we've got 1, 2, 3, 4, about 250.

Craig: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so that's fucking no way.

Josh: So there's a dedication at the, uh, at the front.

Tommy: Shirley's back here dodging. She's at the front. Yep. And we do want to come through. Come through.

Craig: Yep. Just don't—

Josh: Hi Emily, welcome to the Daily Talk Show.

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: Hi Emily. All right, now thank you for coming. I'm about to read to you. Uh, so this is the dedication in 20 Questions.

Josh: Audible presents—

Craig: Are we starting soon?

Josh: Yes, absolutely. This is it.

Tommy: This is it.

Josh: You've arrived. 20 Questions for Humans by Craig Harper, read to you by Tommy Jackett.

Tommy: Dedication: As much as I love my beautiful mum, I am dedicated— I'm dedicating this book to my dad. The man who doesn't read books, the man who rarely gives hugs, the man I have disappointed and sometimes made proud, the man who loves deeply but struggles to express that love, the man who carried his obese 10-year-old son in a father and son piggyback race while the other dads wore their skinny kids like backpacks. The man who, with the biggest handicap in Father-Son Day history, pulled off a Herculean second place. He's the man who always lives his values. The man whose moral compass was often my obstacle. The man who paid me a man's wage when I was 14, as long as I did the man work— I did the work of a man. The man who taught me about principles, responsibility, and work ethic. The man who still adores my mum and protects her fiercely The man who still screams at the telly. The man who had no role model growing up but somehow turned out to be a great man. The man who goes to church every week. The man who won't know how to respond to this dedication. And the man I respect greatly.

Craig: Love you, Dad.

Tommy: I just wanted to know, how did he respond?

Josh: Did he read the book?

Craig: Well, he probably didn't read the books.

Josh: Oops. Oh no. Oh, the coffee.

Craig: That's okay. See, Tommy predicted that. He probably didn't read the book, but he— well, he definitely read that bit because I sent— well, I didn't. I don't do any sending, let's be honest. Melissa sent a book. Melissa sends all the books. Melissa does all the work. Yeah, but so he got the book and I'm talking to Mum. So I ring up and I didn't ring to say, did you go? We were just chatting and, you know, she goes, well, we got the book. I'm like, right. She goes, yeah, it's lovely. I'll put your father on. And he goes, yeah, it's good, looks good, it's a, it's good size, and it's like, I like the, uh, I like the flat and I like the gloss. It sits out well, doesn't it? I'm like, yep. And he goes, yeah, well, you know, the, um, you know. I go, no. And he goes, you know, the, uh, well, the bit you wrote. The bit I wrote.

Josh: The whole thing?

Craig: I go, the bit I wrote. I go, the dedication, Dad. And he goes, well, that was embarrassing. That's Ron's feedback. That's Ron going, fuck, I love you. Thank you so much for writing that. Proud of you. Give us a fucking hug.

Tommy: Geez. There's a chapter in here about self-awareness. What's the exact question that you've— I think it's around the How do I— how am I perceived? I mean, you're the one who should know these questions.

Craig: Well, yeah, I've read it.

Tommy: I mean, I read it as well, but I just forget.

Craig: Oh, the question is, what's it like being around me? Or what's the me experience like? And I think that this is a really good question because we don't live in isolation, we don't live on an island, and we unintentionally and erroneously think that people think like us. And we quite often think that our intention is someone else's experience. So it might be my intention to be mildly amusing and entertaining and somewhat interesting and perhaps slightly inspirational, but the audience's experience is not that. It might be that they are deluded, distracted, or confused, or they're definitely confused today with us here. So it kind of— and I often say to audience, does it matter what people think of you? And often they go, no, fuck them, just be me. And I'm like, no, that's actually dumb because it does matter what people think of you in the sense that if you don't understand how you're perceived, you can't create connection. And connection and communication go— effective communication go hand in hand. So if you want to be an effective parent or an effective friend or role model or teacher or coach or employer or employee or human, you need to at least have a level of awareness of what it's like being around you. Otherwise, you will have a false sense of everything. And so, like, I'm aware that, I'm aware that there are a percentage of people who will really resonate with my communication style my language, my casual way of explaining complicated things. I'm also aware that for other people that won't work, and I'm also aware that I'm going to get 1 or 2 or 3 emails or messages a week from someone going, you're a fucking idiot.

Josh: Do you think, do you think your dad has been aware of the type of relationship or the impact that he's sort of had on you?

Craig: Um, I think, you know, I always say if you want to know someone, pay a little bit of attention to what they say and a lot of attention to what they do. And my dad is very much— he is— his emotional awareness and perhaps intelligence, it's probably not the right word, but his ability to communicate emotion is not amazing. But is he loving and generous and kind? And yes, he is. Does he articulate his feelings well? No. Terribly. But I always say that if you want to understand somebody, then understand their story. So my dad grew up in— I probably don't want to say it publicly too much, but a not very good environment. Abusive, violent at times. And like, my life, my childhood was Hollywood compared to his and the way he was treated and the love that he didn't get and the care and the nurturing that he didn't get. I got relatively, I got all of that, you know. And so compared to where he came from and what he experienced and his role modeling, which there was none, my dad was virtually father of the year, father of the century.

Tommy: I think it's definitely changing, isn't it? You know, that generational self-awareness or just willingness to engage in their feelings. Why is that changing, do you think?

Craig: I think it's— we live in a— I mean, this is obvious when we go, a different time and a different culture. But I mean, back when my dad was literally growing up, there were 6 boys in one family in the Depression, 8 mouths to feed. So if you got a sandwich, it was fucking exciting, you know? So just the practical reality for a lot of people when my dad was 10 versus when I was 10, The practical reality for my dad at 10 years of age was just one of survival, like trying to get food, trying not to be starving, trying to figure out how to make these 5-year-old shoes still fit or work. Or I think we just inhabit a much— and I'm generalizing, but I know that I definitely, compared to my dad, I had a totally privileged upbringing. You know, I was one kid. I had my choice of bedrooms, I had a bike, I had private schools, I had a skateboard, I had 3 meals a day, I had parents that loved me, I never got beaten, I never got screamed at, you know. But, you know, there's that amazing book which is called The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman where he talks about, you know, the ways that people give and experience love. And my dad's love language, in terms of what he responds to, is words of affirmation. Ironically, he doesn't give that much, but that's, you know, with him, when you tell him that his garden is amazing or his artwork, because he's a brilliant artist, you tell him how brilliant his work is, or that's— that for him fills up his love cup.

Tommy: I'm pretty happy my dad's is acts of service, so if I just want him to build anything for me, he'll come do it ASAP.

Craig: Well, his love— my dad's love language is the same.

Tommy: Is he?

Craig: Yeah, if I said give us a hug, he'd say fuck off. If I said paint my house, he'll say see you in the morning. Like, it's true. I'll be there at 8 with my fucking brushes. But if I go, can I have a cuddle, you old fucker? He's like, no.

Tommy: What's your love language?

Craig: My love language is, um, uh, with people that I care, that I care about, quality time. Um, and I guess Craig loves me, we've spent a bit of quality time because I'm an insecure fuck, I guess, still. Words of affirmation. Yeah, so, um, great answer. Pardon?

Josh: Great answer.

Craig: Thank you. See what he did there? Um, I think I'm taking that off.

Tommy: Yeah, it's a bit hot, isn't it?

Josh: You can wear it like a DJ if you want.

Craig: I'll come back.

Josh: You've done mine. But did you have to unlearn some of those things that your dad taught you about how to love?

Craig: Well, I think, you know, we're constantly being taught but not consciously being taught. Right? So my dad never went to me, love is XYZ, it's not ABC or DEF, it's XYZ. But, but your parents are always teaching you, for better or worse. Um, and, and, you know, for me, most of the time it's for the better. But like, we— our, you know, our brains are data processing, data absorbing, you know, centers. And so we are always taking data on board. You know, we have 70,000 thoughts a day. 90% of those thoughts we had yesterday, right? We're always interpreting stimuli around us. And it doesn't matter, you know, if you want to be like your parents or not, you will be like your parents on some level, even if you think you're not. There will be stuff that rubs off for better or worse. And so I think the whole thing of— in this part of the book and part of the human experience is You know, rather than just going— because I think a lot of people go, oh, well, that's just how he is. Oh, well, that's just how she is. Well, this is just me. I'm not the athletic one, or I'm not academic, or I am this, or I'm not that. These are just storeys that we tell ourselves. Like, I remember when I wrote my first book, which was 2003, it was called Fatitude. So 2003, I was, um, 63. I was 40. I'm like, fuck, who am I to write a book? Yeah, who am I to write a book? No one will read it. And that was the reinforcement I got. People like, well, you know, oh, it's good you're writing a book, but they're very hard to get published. And most people were kind of saying you won't get it published. And then by the time I wrote my, I don't know, 9th or 10th book, it's not like, can I write a book? It's like, can I write a book that will be a book that people want to read? How am I going to distribute it? How am I going to sell it? How are we going to market it? How is it going to be different? What's the right formula? How many words? How do I make it readable and digestible and valuable for people? And then how do I turn that obviously, or hopefully, into actual product as well, you know. So I think that long-winded answer is that we're always being taught and we're always being influenced and we're always being moulded and programmed by everything external, be that TV, social media, government, parents, school, friends. But the challenge for us in the middle of all of that external stimuli is in the middle of that to be a conscious being that's aware of what's happening around us and to us, and then to figure out who we are and how we are independently irrespective of those forces.

Josh: Can we help change our storey if we decide that we get to a certain age and the way that people have sort of set us up, or maybe even how we've set ourselves up as a story, has changed? Are they individual conversations? Is it like, hey, Mum and Dad, I'm actually different to who I was when I was this age?

Craig: Yeah, I think we're always evolving, but I think we often, and understandably, we get put in a pigeonhole or a box, or we get stereotyped by people in our world who, one, see us a certain way, which is okay, and two, want us to be a certain way. So the challenge is for us to write our story, not to be a character in someone else's version, their version of what our storey should be. And I had my own storey about who I was and how my storey was. I'm the fat kid who's not very good at anything. And then I started to do a few things, not because I had amazing self-belief, but just because there was enough emotional leverage. I pain to go, fuck this.

Josh: Is there a risk in being so detached to the other storey that you end up actually, that becomes even more a defining factor? So your weight and all that sort of thing. Is there a point where it's like, actually, I'm not only not that person who was overweight, but I actually don't even need to reference it. It's not even important.

Craig: Oh yeah.

Josh: Yeah.

Craig: I think we get hung up on stuff and I've been hung up on stuff and I think we, you know, I think sometimes the pendulum swings, the pendulum swings, and sometimes people who, for example, used to eat meat and now they're vegans, now they're fucking evangelicals who drive everyone nuts. It's like, cool, be a vegan, but you don't have to try and make me one. God bless your socks. Yeah, I think it's great and I respect you, but you don't have to twist my arm, just like I don't need to twist your arm to eat meat. And I think so, some people become whatever it is that they are running away from, then they embrace the opposite of that, and then they try and evangelise the world around their value system and their belief. And I think that's— I understand how that happens, but it's also not a good way to create connection. Yeah. So becoming a person of influence in a good way is not only about having a message and having values and having a philosophy or an ideology that's sound, but more importantly, being aware of who wants to hear that and when. So there are many, many, many, many times where I would have— I see an opportunity to help somebody, but I know that that person doesn't want to learn or doesn't want to hear from me because I'm just not getting it. And so I don't, and that's okay.

Tommy: I mean, it's hard when it's a loved one, when you want to be telling them the thing that they need or you think that they need.

Craig: So I wrote about that in, um, um, I don't know one of my books, Stop Fuckin' Around, I think, where I spoke about the fact that my mum smoked from when— I think mum smoked from when she was about 15 until she was about 60, which is 45 years, right?

Josh: And she stopped at 60?

Craig: Yes.

Mason: Yeah.

Josh: Do you remember that, what that moment was like?

Craig: Well, I remember from when she was 40 to 60, I badgered the fuck out of her, right? And the— and because, okay, you could say it took 20 years.

Tommy: Of badgering for it to work.

Craig: But the thing was, was I sharing her a valuable— was I sharing a valuable message? Yes. Were my intentions good? Yes. Was my information correct? Yes. Is it potentially lethal? Yes. Did she want to hear from me?

Tommy: No.

Craig: Right. And so instead of creating awareness and engagement and an appropriate— what I thought was an appropriate positive response— all I created with my mum, who didn't want to hear, she didn't want me to teach her, was resentment and disconnection. And then I finally stopped because it took me 20 years because I'm that dumb. And then a year or two later, all by herself, she gave up. Yeah, with no help from me. And so good intentions don't always equal a good result. And I mean, you know, there are varying degrees of that. If you've got an addict child who's about to go down the deepest hole, you know, I get it. But, but in general terms I'm not— I'm never going to try to teach someone who doesn't want me to teach them, ever.

Tommy: You wrote about intentions in here and that it's not people's interpretation most of the time. The intention— I've always gone into situations where, I mean, it's pretty noisy environment these days online, you know, people can comment about anything anyone's doing now. And when you— and I've kind of held myself going, I know my intentions are good here, so it's okay. Is that limiting though, to some degree, where the feedback might not be great but you knew your intentions are great?

Craig: I think as long as you know your intentions are good, your motives are good, but at the same time having enough awareness and situational awareness and practical intelligence to know when's a good time to share and when's not. I think the limitation of social media— like, I put up something the other day and it said essentially Dear world, please be more loving and less, less religious, right? So that's my message. And I grew up in a religious environment, and my parents are religious, so I have nothing against religion. But I think there's a lot of bad shit done in the name of religion. Not that religion's the cause, but there's not many bad things done that come from a place of love. Do you know what I'm saying? And so what I was trying to say was um, if, if everything that we do, as much as humanly possible, comes from that platform of I want to help, I want to love, I want to be kind, I want to be generous, I want to serve, then I probably can't fuck up. But at the same time, it's possible to be very religious and not at all loving or kind or generous, and I've seen it many times. And so I wasn't trying to be anti-religion, I was trying to be pro-love. But a whole bunch— wow, fuck yeah! I'm like, okay. Because you can't articulate it with just a thing on a whiteboard. So I took it down because I thought it's going to start a shitfest. I know what I meant.

Mason: Yeah.

Craig: And I actually wasn't being derogatory to religious people because in fact I was religious quite, quite a, a lot, a big part of my life. Um, and so I have respect for religion, but I also think that, want it or not, like it or not, believe it or not, we are whether or not it's with our football team or our religion or our ideology around food, or— we have all been indoctrinated. All of us. You, me, everyone in this hall, 800 of the people in the room. Shut up. Or if you're gonna fucking laugh, I sound like 800 people. But the thing is to have that awareness that I've been programmed. Have that awareness that I only think the way that I think because of the shit that I've been through. And so this is why, like, asking these questions about what do I think the way that I think— is it, is it just a byproduct of my life, or do I think this way because I've consciously created this cognitive landscape by asking and searching and seeking and putting myself in a place where I want— I don't want to be right, I want to grow. I don't want to win, I want to evolve. And if that means me going, I fucked up and I'm a dickhead and I'm sorry and I'm wrong, but I'm being humble and real, then that's, that's where I want to go.

Josh: There's obviously a lot of questions that we can ask ourselves. Are there certain questions that you think are good of asking of other people?

Craig: Us asking other people?

Josh: Yeah.

Craig: Yeah, I think like, what's it like being around me? Not because I want approval or attention or because I want you to tell I'm ace, but because I want to have a relationship with you where it's win-win. And I want to have a relationship with you where we're on the same page. And I want to ask you also, um, so we're in this relationship, Josh, this business, or we're in this conversation, or we're sorting through this issue or challenge. What's your version of this? Because It's in my interest and your interest and his interest and everyone's interest to at least understand, not agree with necessarily, not embrace, but at least to understand each other's reality.

Josh: Can it be structured where it doesn't feel like— because I feel like these questions are great when we're hitting a point of turmoil or things are hard. How do I not seem like a weird unit by taking him out for a coffee and just asking you, you know, what am I like to be around, Craig, without you going, when you're not so weird?

Craig: Okay, um, I just think that stuff comes up organically. Like, I met with somebody this morning who's going through some shit, and, um, uh, we met for an hour and a quarter, and I would have done 5% of the talking and she would have done 95%. So it's just knowing when to talk and when not to talk. And I think it doesn't, you know, if you ask something and you seem a bit weird or feel it, it doesn't matter.

Josh: Yeah.

Craig: Like it does. So what? I'm like, I have lots of people that think I'm weird for a range of reasons.

Tommy: That's me.

Craig: But thank you.

Tommy: But I love you.

Craig: Thank you. But all I care about really is that I'm doing my best to live aligned to my values, which I didn't always do.

Tommy: Question 2: What are my core values and how do I live in alignment?

Josh: It's fucking Eddie McGuire here from Who Wants to Be a Millionaire. Do you want to phone a friend?

Tommy: No, what I loved here is you wrote, when I'm in alignment, which is not all the time, my experience is usually one of calm and contentment. And when I'm out of alignment, it happens, my experience usually sits somewhere on the scale around anxiety, misery, disappointment, and guilt. I hadn't heard you say that bit about feeling what it's like for you feeling when you're out of alignment. Is that, do you think, a good gauge for other people in terms of listening to that level of anxiety, disappointment, or guilt to gauge whether they are living out of alignment?

Craig: Maybe. I mean, usually I— my observation is that when people are living a more aligned existence, which just means Well, what's the stuff that really matters to me? You know, love, connection, people, purpose, living my beliefs and values. I guess that's the stuff that really matters to me. Not that there's anything wrong with driving a Porsche or living in a mansion or earning a million bucks a year. Nothing wrong with any of that. But I think for the most part, when people are like— we've all met people who are living what we would call a successful existence. It's all shiny and fucking amazing, who are also taking Xanax and Valium and Prozac and 3 other kind of mood enhancers or anxiety controllers or whatever. And so what we know is that it's very easy— it's not easy, but it's very possible to have an external existence which looks amazing but an internal reality which is fucking diabolical. So I don't care about how shiny someone's life is, I care about what's their experience in the moment. Because I've worked with lots of high-profile, wealthy, successful, well-known people who I would say are disproportionately less happy than my run-of-the-mill friends. And I know that's a very broad statement, but it's true. Where— because I think in our culture, and this is getting deep, but— and these are just my thoughts— but I think in our culture, largely, we are taught that success is what you have, what you own, what you earn, what you look like, and what people think of you. Right? And so you— that's what you grow up going, fuck, I've got to look like this. I did that. I go, all I wanted to do was be— because I was this fat kid who was picked last for every sporting team and all these things, so I associated my body with negative stuff. So I went, well, fuck, if I can have an amazing body, then that'll equal good stuff. And then I started to get in shape, and I got more popular, and I started to get picked for sporting teams. I started to win. So I drew this unhealthy, unhealthy correlation between my physical state and success. And in a way it can be, but I kind of thought that was the totality of it, you know. And then I woke up when I was 22 and just wanted to be Mr. Universe, and I was this 100-kilo insecure overthinking, um, fuckwit with great big muscles and 5% body fat, you know. And I was still looking for approval, and I still wanted I could never be big enough or lean enough or anything enough, but it was never about my body. It was always about the internal stuff.

Josh: Why do you think we make the same mistakes over and over again?

Craig: Because we don't address the cause. We don't address the cause. We go, "Oh, I need a 70-inch telly. Fuck you, get it now. It must be the 75. No, I need the 80. No, no, I need a giant cock. That's what I need. I'll get a great big 12-inch fucking— that's what I'll—" Whatever. Like, it's— we always think— I thought it was quite elegant. We don't articulate this, but we think that something external, a thing, a brand, a Facebook number of likes or whatever, will fix some internal issue.

Josh: Because it does temporarily in some regard. I think that's part of the trick, right? Which is especially on that retail stuff.

Craig: It just distracts us. Yeah. Like, I remember buying $130,000 cars and 4 days later going, yeah, I didn't like it.

Tommy: But is the, is the dip— so the, the raise in endorphins and excitement you get from these purchases, or, you know, whatever you're looking at, that gives you the enjoyment of that? Like, say if you bought fucking expensive headphones. Yeah, for example. For example, happy about it, then your mate doesn't want to wear it.

Craig: Exactly. What true kind of— and we We chucked out the 5 years back.

Josh: That was your choice to chuck out the box.

Tommy: Anyway, no, but so there's something in that up and down where it's like it feels greater than the sort of plateau of happiness.

Josh: Yeah, it feels like we move forward a little bit, but it seems like a two-step forwards, one step back. I guess where I noticed it in a big way was Facebook started doing their Memories stuff, right? And then I was like It would get to certain times of the year and I'm like, hang on, this was, I see a picture, I'm like, I'm doing something just the same as why I did the November. It's like, oh, every Sunday, why is it every Sunday is the last day that I'm always going to eat shit food? It's always on a Sunday and I go fucking hard every Sunday. And Tommy pointed out to me, Josh, you've done that every fucking Sunday this year. And so it's really just a cheat day. So how do we actually like shift that? Because it feels like at the time it's like you've got this amazing amount of force, but the mistakes keep on happening.

Craig: Okay, so let's talk about your eating. Yeah, great. So I mean, the thing is that that behaviour with you where every Sunday you fuck up and tell yourself this story, that's not new, that's longstanding, right? Yeah. So that's hardwired. That's you on autopilot being a fuckwit. Yeah, right. Absolutely. That's you, Josh the fuckwit, telling himself a storey despite your significant intelligence.

Josh: So questionable.

Craig: So you're not going to fix that by Tuesday. So there needs to be, there needs to be an internal shift on a subconscious level because your subconscious controls most of your behaviors, the big stuff. Not, you know, will I have that milk or that milk, or will I wear the blue or brown socks? But, but in terms of the way that you typically behave day to day on a kind of autopilot level, that's your subconscious. And so your patterns and your predictable behaviours and your habits, destructive and good, they're all hardwired into your subconscious mind. And so for you, it's a matter of recognizing, you know, it starts with acknowledgement, humility, and awareness. No bullshit. Don't give yourself a fucking get out of jail card. Like, the truth is, you've done this, I don't know, let's just say the last 50 Sundays in a row. Chances of you not doing it this Sunday, next to zero. Yeah. So if nothing changes, nothing changes. Is that a challenge? So, well, I would love a challenge.

Josh: It feels like that's exactly plays into my old thing.

Craig: You don't need a challenge because that's bullshit too.

Josh: I'll get a fucking DEXA scan.

Craig: No, but no, again, that's just another thing you do for a while. Yeah, absolutely. See, oh, I got a DEXA scan, I started this thing. Fuck starting a thing. Bought a pressure cooker. Change your operating system, because when you change your cognitive default setting, the behaviours will happen. The problem— the behaviours are not the problem. The behaviours are the consequence of the problem. The problem is internal, but that manifests externally in this, right? So that's why we go, I'll change that. No, don't change that. Change this, change how you think, change how you operate, change your default setting, change your relationship with food, change the storey that you tell yourself over time, and then that will be a byproduct. So when, when you eating in a way which serves your body is hardwired into your operating system, you don't need discipline, you don't need self-control, you don't need motivation, you don't need willpower, because now you are living in alignment with your values. And I would say one of your values is health, and I'd say one of your values is healthy eating, and I'd say one of your values is being in the best shape that you can without being egotistical or vain, but managing that irreplaceable gift that you've got for the next 30, 40, 50 years, right? So the thing is, this is a value. Then we have a value-driven existence where we go, well, one of my values is to live in the best version of this I can. Cool. Now what are the behaviours from a lifestyle, from a food, from a sleep, from a self-management, from an exercise point of view What are the behaviours that for me need to be non-negotiable?

Josh: I think the non-negotiable thing is a, is a big one because it's when you can start to play in, oh well, it's okay on this day, or if it's this occasion.

Tommy: Well, I've tried a bunch of different sort of programmes and things to sort of stay on track. And this year I've done this thing where I train every second day. It doesn't matter what I do, I have to do something. And it has to be, I cannot have 2 days off. And what that has done for me, and I used to be a PT and I had a good regimen, but this is the thing that has kept me the most consistent, where it's like, doesn't matter what it is, every second day. And it's shifted everything else around that, what I'm deciding to eat, when I'm training, I'm like, I don't feel like eating shit at night. But for me, I've, yeah, I mean, that's just one thing I've tried that's worked.

Josh: It's the reframing, because I think about like the podcast we've done 311 episodes. We haven't missed a weekday. I went to Europe for 4 months. You know, we did it remotely. We made it work. And so if I think about if I could just bring even 1/10 of that energy, I think it would make a massive difference.

Tommy: I told Josh today that he's missing his why. And it's because I've been reading your book, Question 6.

Josh: Well, yeah, because we deconstructed my New Year's. We deconstructed my New Year's resolutions. Yeah, because I've got—

Craig: I saw that the daily, the weekly, the monthly, the annual.

Tommy: And it was so funny because as I'm reading question 6, I'm like, and knowing what Josh's list is, I was like, totally, totally left out the why. Yeah, 3.

Craig: I want you to tell me what you think. Yeah, yeah, yeah, terrific.

Josh: I mean, we'll just go like weekly: visit the gym 3 times per week, write 1 personal blog post, write 1 industry/business blog post, cook for Bree and I twice.

Tommy: There was also walk for 1 hour per day.

Josh: Oh yeah, that was my daily. I thought, blueys, like, a little early.

Tommy: Well, I think that's a lot. An hour a day.

Josh: An hour a day is fine. Yeah, we, we don't normally— we've never done that on a live show. I think Tommy's— I think— no, you do, but I think Tommy's detached. He says it so much, he's attached— detached it from the fact that he's talking about ejaculation. He was talking about 12-inch penises before, and I get the bloody slack from talking about a load because you— yeah, you're being— know your audience.

Tommy: I don't know any of these people.

Josh: I mean, have there been any specific times, Craig, where— when do you basically identify you're falling off the tracks in regards to these things? Have you got early identifiers where it's like, if I— Tommy talks about, I can't miss more than, you know, 2 days in a row or whatever. What is it for you?

Craig: Okay, let me say 2 things. So first thing is, I like, I really like that, and I really like your every second day. So when we're talking about transformation, so you going from your current operating system to, um, one that's going to work for you, it's, it's— we do need to be strategic. So you need a plan, but you also need to go, uh, but I also know me. So is it realistic for me to go, right, I'm going to do fucking every day? Probably not. So you go, what is more realistic? And then you create that as a base, and you might build on it, or you might stay there. Um, what was it?

Josh: Yeah, so what's your next bit?

Craig: When do you know? Yeah, so look, the older I get, the more I pay attention to that still small voice. And I don't know what that is or where that comes from, but it's smarter than me.

Josh: And you know, it could be this kid, it could be him.

Craig: He could have put some chips in my brain.

Josh: We just hired him, it's easier that way than storing him in the brain. Really? Yeah, that's right. It's very good.

Craig: Are you expensive?

Josh: He's actually quite, quite reasonable.

Craig: Well, I've got Alex the intern who I exploit the fuck out of, so we all need one. Yeah. Um, but I, I always say, um, your life will tell you. So my life is always telling me something. So the way that people respond to me is— that's, that's information. The way that my body responds to various stimuli, that's information. Like Your body's a biofeedback system. It's always telling you something. Your results in business are always telling you something. The amount of people that, you know, your podcast doing this, doing this, doing this, then you get to a point it does that. Well, that's which it won't do with you two, but that's, that's no, but the fact that, okay, so let's look at your podcast. Yeah. So you've, you've done this very beautiful and linear growth because you guys are very likable. You're both charismatic, you're both good dudes. You have really good conversations. You know how to market and brand, you know how to create good audio, good content. You know how to shoot things. And so you're very strategic. But in the middle of all of the strategy, in a fucking overwhelm of podcasts, you guys, I believe, will have one of the best and most successful podcasts in Australia and eventually perhaps the world in this space because you are very good and very consistent. Because the amount of people who go, fuck, I'm going to do a podcast and buy 3 bits of equipment and talk to their fucking neighbour 4 times and go, oh, I tried it, it didn't work. Because you just— you guys are talented and all that stuff, but the level of commitment and work that you have wrapped around your core ability and your focus is fucking amazing. So if you could take a bit of that to some of the stuff that for you is a personal challenge, right, then, you know, you'd kill that other stuff as well. But it's very unsexy.

Josh: I think that's the realisation is I've never had anything that I've— we've been able to do this consistently. And I constantly think about, wow, like Tommy did say, um, uh, brought up the idea of doing push-ups before the show. As it was, well, because, well, we thought, well, this was when I was pushing back on the gym. The idea being that we do the fucking show every day. At least if we do it before the show, it will get done. 50 push-ups? Better than now. Yeah, it's very true. But I think there is something in the, you know, taking the consistent thing, which is the unsexy thing. It doesn't even feel like it makes any— like part of that, Tommy and I went to the gym, you know, 3 times a week for the first part of the year, January. January 8th. January 8th. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. The first couple of weeks of Jan. And the thing was that I was like— still paying membership. So fitness first. I'm part of that percentage, you know, the ones like I'm the 85% that's funding all of you guys in the audience. But the thing is, I don't know where I was going with that. I think so. I'm just going to—

Tommy: Where the fuck are you? I don't know where I am right now.

Josh: I've just fucking treadmill. Yeah.

Tommy: No, but so if you look at someone like— If we take it away from our situation, There's a lot of people's situations, the right now is shit and where they want to go to is good. And so it's really hard in that shitty situation, correct, to make the progress.

Craig: Yeah. So, but that, that this is shit is, um, that's, that's part of the human experience. It's like people want to— like, everybody wants a better something. Everybody wants a better life or a better body or a better job or a better internal state or a better marriage or a better level of motivation or better outcomes or better financial situation. Everybody wants something better, but for the most part, that's never going to just occur. We need to create that or let go of it, right? So it's not just going to eventuate, but generally to get from where we are metaphorically to where we want to be will involve decision-making, effort, energy, discomfort, unfamiliarity, and/or a combination of those things. So, and you've— most of you have heard me say this, but the— so the dichotomy is, on the one hand, I want to learn, grow, evolve, become fucking amazing, resilient, mentally, emotionally tougher, but at the same time, I don't want to get uncomfortable, right? Yeah. So we're attached to comfort while wanting to grow, but comfort and growth don't go together. So it's All right, so, you know, like, I get asked once a day, how do I do what you do? How do I become a professional speaker? And I get asked quite often, how do I get over my fear of public speaking? And the answer is public speaking. Public speaking. You can't get good at what you don't do. Yeah, but I'm terrified. Yep, but I've never met anyone who's died from public speaking, you know, so you'll be okay.

Josh: I'm sure there's been a bad stage fall or something like that, but has to have been. You talk about the 3, taking 3 days off a year just to be on your own. Yeah. How long have you actively— 10 years.

Craig: I did 10 days, but I do, I spend a lot of time by myself because I travel a lot and I'm away in hotels by myself. Yeah. So I have 24, 48 hours where I'm not with anyone anyway. I'll just go out and talk to a bunch of people for an hour or 2, then fuck off. So I get— and I'm not married and I don't have kids and I live by myself, so I spend a lot of time alone, but like, I talk to people who are never alone. And, and so I think it's very good to get literal geographical and metaphoric space from your life because you can't be objective about the thing that you're in the middle of. And some people have been living an existence, a Groundhog Day existence, and not wanting to be there. I mean, in that same existence for years but never really found the courage or the time or the space or the awareness or the whatever to figure out exactly where they want to be. Like, I know I don't want to be here, I don't know where I want to be, but I don't want to be here. And, and I know that, and most people here probably know that, often when you're away from your life, so to speak, when you're away from your, your day-to-day it's really easy to see things more clearly and go, well, fuck, why do I continue to do that? And you don't have to. We just tell ourselves we have to. And I'm not saying, okay, you're in a job you hate, so quit tomorrow and there'll be a brand new one. I'm not saying that. But what I'm saying is it might take you 1, 2, 3, 4 years to transition, but that's not a reason to not do it. Yeah, because 4 years are going to come and go anyway. 5 years are going to come and go anyway, you know. Um, I interviewed a guy this afternoon at my place on a real podcast. Um, what's it called? It's called The Year Project. Yeah, called Dr. Richard Heisman. And we were talking about stuff, and he's, um, an academic obviously, and good guy. And, and I was telling him a storey about how I somehow stumbled my way into a PhD placement to do a PhD in philosophy quite a few years ago. Did you know that, Tom? No, did you finish it? Sure didn't.

Josh: So I didn't hear about it.

Craig: I'd have a shirt that said Doc. I didn't even really start. And anyway, I was saying to him, he goes, you should do it, right? And I go, oh yeah, I'm kind of busy. And he goes, but you could use your business and your, you know, your data and your books and the people that you have access to as kind of your subjects and your— you could base your— and I'm like, and I don't know if I'm going to do that, but like it got me a bit excited. I thought, fuck, imagine if I could marry a PhD with what I do and do it together. And I went, so what if I'm 61 or 62 when I get my PhD? So what? Like, because part of me is going, oh, don't be ridiculous, you're fucking 55. And immediately I started to find reasons not to do it. But the kid in me is like, fuck, that'd be great! Dr. Harper, just to shit people, you know. But it's like, what? I don't know if I will, but what if I want to? I will.

Tommy: Um, question 20. Not jumping to the end, this is not the end, but it's a big question. Sure. What's the meaning of life?

Josh: As he sips his coffee. Yeah.

Craig: So the, the book is not, here's the question, here's the answer. The book is a guy who talks to lots of people, has thousands of conversations to everyone, to people from everything about their bum and legs to their happiness to their purpose to their children's drug addiction to their bank balance to what happens when we die to, to, you know, existentialism to everything, right? To, to, you know, why we're here psychologically, emotionally, spiritually, socially. It's— and so this, this is really just a bunch of questions that we explore. And the most asked question in philosophy is, what's the meaning of life? Or one of the most asked questions. And I think the better question is, what's the meaning of my life? Because I think you can go down the hole— and I love philosophy, but I also love living practically. And, um, because life is, it is kind of a philosophy, but it's also an experience to be lived, and relationships are to be lived, and insight is to be gained, and wisdom is to be gleaned and applied. So for me, it's more the, the gist of that is rather than trying to subscribe to or adhere to or discover some, uh, divine or perhaps predetermined purpose for your life as per prescribed by someone else or something else, why don't you say not what's the meaning of life but what's the meaning of my life? And, and the meaning of your life is optional. So the meaning of my life is to help people. That's the focus, is to teach, is to coach, is to encourage people to explore their talent, explore their possibilities, explore their potential. That is the meaning of my life. And of course around that, I'll have fun and tell dick jokes and ride my motorbikes and lift weights and train with the Crab and talk shit and talk shit with you two. But the meaning of my life is really to help others be happier and more fulfilled and to grow and learn. Why is that the meaning of my life? Because one, that's what I've chosen, and two, that's what I believe I'm meant to do. So if there's any predetermination, I feel like that's inherently what I'm meant to do. Do I think everybody's meant to do that?

Josh: No. Have you ever had an aha moment or a perception shift that's only happened based on the amount of time you've spent on this earth that you wish younger people understood? Basically, I want to fucking hack, like, I want to use you as a way of working out what I need to do.

Craig: Well, I think, I think the—

Tommy: and you got 3 minutes.

Craig: I think that understanding that— I think we all get this, but we don't get it— is that we exist in 2 worlds: an external, physical, 3-dimensional world where we can sit in a room like this where our macro reality in this moment is same room, same time, same stimulus, same guys, same voices, same temperature in the room, same shitty chairs that you're all sitting on. So we're all having on a macro level a very, uh, common experience. But on a micro level, we've got— all jokes aside, you know— 25 people or something in the room. So we've got 25 people. Nobody in the room is having the same experience. That fucking fascinates me. So your experience is not mine, mine is not Tommy's, Tommy's is not Mr. 97's, and so on. So no one in the room is having the same experience. So no one is inhabiting on a personal level the same reality. And, and so the realities could be ranging in this room from extremely positive to extremely negative, just depending on the data processing centre and the storeys that the individual is telling themselves. So for me, it's understanding that Yes, I need to manage my practical external world and have a job and drive a car and live in a house and pay my bills and be nice to other humans and stop at the red and go at the green and all that kind of stuff. But that is not where I live. That's just where I do life. Where I live is in my head and in my emotions and in my feelings and in my behaviour and in my relationships with people. And so, you know, how many times you talk to someone you know, around Christmas where you go, what are your goals for next year? And they go, you know what, I just want to figure out why I'm so broken, and I want to work on— I want to work on becoming more empathetic and aware. I want to become better at asking questions, better at paying attention. I want to be more loving. I want to be less judgmental. I want to be— right? I'm not saying we should all do that all the time, but what's the typical thing? Earn this, own that, drive that, change that, build that, renovate that. Fucking do. It's all external. Yeah, we are externally obsessed, but nobody fucking lives in a plasma screen or a fucking Porsche or whatever. Even metaphorically, we don't live in a house. You exist in a house, but it's not where you live. Where you live is in your thinking and your feeling and your emoting and your loving and your giving and your receiving. That's where you live.

Josh: In a couple of minutes, we'll open the floor for anyone that's got questions. So if you do have one, Mr. 97 will come around. So when we do ask you, just put your hand up and then Mr. 97 walks over with the microphone.

Craig: I didn't know we were doing that. Yeah, we are.

Tommy: Sorry about that. How's your experience, Mr. 97, of this event tonight? How are you feeling, mate? Oh, it's great. I'm learning heaps. I think one question that I have, because I think a lot of these questions, I guess, are sort of overwhelming to think of. So what would be something that I could do to start growing more and just, yeah, start developing?

Craig: Okay, here's— I mean, I could answer that 100 ways, so I'll answer it this way. How old are you? 19. When are you 20? November 1st.

Tommy: My shoes are 20, you fucker. Before he started with us, he— this would have scared the absolute shit out of him. That's what it still is. So it scares the shit out of me.

Craig: Okay, so, and I can answer this 50 ways, and what I'm about to give you is not the best answer, but it's, it's an okay answer. Up. And even, you know, see, the thing, 5 years for me is like that. For 5 years, it's 25% of your life. Yeah, so far, right? But I would start to think about, for you, did you say 19? Yep. Yep. Okay, so let's round you up to 20. So I would go, what do I want my life rounding up? What do I want my life to look like when I'm 25? If everything goes great What will I be doing in work, in academia, the daily talk show, your daily talk show? Will you have your own one? Will it be called Mr. 97 Does Vegas? Um, so it's trying to get clear about perhaps maybe even in one year, get your head around one year. So even if you go, what's the date today?

Tommy: The 25th. So 25th of March.

Craig: So if you go 25th of March 2020, so you got 365 days from now, everything's gone fucking great. Okay, cool. What does great look like? Yeah, sure. With your body, with your school, with your career, with these guys, with your friends, with your girlfriend, boyfriend, both. Um, whatever.

Josh: Busy. He's really busy. So is this Blues guy thinking—

Tommy: because I know that the, the, your lizard brain pops in, I probably can't do that, I probably won't have that money, I probably couldn't get that physique.

Craig: Yeah, well, definitely. But it's like training for a marathon. You're definitely not going to run a marathon unless you start training. So the worst that will happen if you don't get the marathon, you'll be way fitter than you are now, you know. So it's, it's about going, what's in my control, what's not. What's, what's not totally in my control is everything that might happen over the next year and what the outcome might be. It's not totally in your control because there are external variables. But what is in your control control is who you spend time with, what you expose your mind to, uh, your choices, your behaviors, your standards, your values, the kind of person you want to work to be. So that, you know, and, and this is about— I believe that, that we largely live, and I'm generalising and this is not an offence to anyone, not meant to be, that we live very, um, or we live largely unconsciously. And so this is more going I want to be more conscious about the way my life turns out rather than just being this passenger, because a year's going to come and go no matter what. Yeah, if you're a fuckwit or you're the most deep-thinking, life-changing, you know, like, it's gonna— there's gonna— years gonna come and go and you're gonna be here anyway.

Tommy: Josh, do you think we should use this moment to get a bit of date coaching? Oh yeah, absolutely. So we set Mr. 90— well, we facilitated—

Craig: I don't know if that is a great plan.

Tommy: We facilitated his first ever date at the age of 19. He'd never been out on a date with a girl, and now he's had two.

Josh: Yeah, so we, so we connected up with a podcast called Shameless. They have a massive female audience. Yes. And so basically they threw him to the wolves. Yeah, Mr. 97 had, uh, how many people have you got following you on Instagram? 166. Yeah, yeah, 95% women. Yeah, all, all very Cain? I mean, what if—

Craig: what, in all seriousness, fucking— as if he needs advice.

Josh: Well, I know, but I think he does.

Craig: I should get advice from him.

Tommy: No, no, but I think it's a, an internal— so like, not, not advice about the date or whatever, but I think about him, a guy who hadn't been on dates before, who'd had a bit of confidence issues.

Craig: Uh, I, I think you got to reframe it. I, I think, you know, if you're going to catch up with a girl Um, don't, don't get out of the 'I'm going on a date' story. Just go, 'I'm going to date.' We fucked it then, really, because we've really pushed the—

Josh: well, fucking, as if you two have any idea. Yeah, um, it's a fair— these are all fair points coming out on the show.

Craig: Um, I would, I would, as, as easy— well, this is easier said than done, but I would, you know I would go into that going, I'm just going to have an experience with another person and not, you know, not expect anything other than to have a time, have a good time with someone else. And if you see them again or don't see them again, it's, it's cool. And it's not a win or a loss, and it's not good or bad. It's just an experience. Sure. Um, and you know, like I mean, I think no matter what the situation, that creating connection with somebody is 99% about being genuinely in the moment and listening to them and not trying to get across whatever. It's just, just listening, paying attention, asking good questions. Yeah. And being genuine. Like, like, I know that sounds cheesy, but I mean, if you really want advice, like You know what's not impressive? People who try to impress. Yeah, fucking the worst thing you can do is try to be impressive.

Josh: It's my most annoying.

Craig: You might as well wear a t-shirt that says I'm insecure. Yeah, you know, just, just be a good dude.

Josh: Yeah, annoyingly he's been doing exactly that and I've been telling him to push harder, so I'm glad that you're here.

Tommy: Just on a side note, what does your t-shirt say? Sorry I'm late, I didn't want to be here.

Josh: Was that specially made for tonight? Are they official Daily Talk Show t-shirts?

Craig: This is one of my mentees. I'll give him a plug. His name is Jack the Bear. Jack the Bear. Jack the Bear. He makes these and he gave me this. So thank you, Jack. Jackie boy.

Tommy: Very funny. Did anyone have a question? And you can't not have one because I've asked now. I don't— I'm going to send Mr. 97 your way. No, definitely we have a question. I mean, you paid all this money to come here. Exactly.

Josh: If you don't, I've definitely got many.

Tommy: Yeah, or I've got a book down here with 20.

Josh: Well, here we go. I mean, the one thing that I'm thinking is like, it makes sense, the, you know, all the stuff that you talk about makes a lot of sense. I guess one of the things is around when life throws you a curveball. So you can be super in touch with what you're doing. You can be doing all the things right, ticking all of the boxes, and then shit can go wrong. People close to you die, people close to you get sick, and then all of a sudden you have to reframe all of those things. You've got the things that you can control, and then you have these things that can happen. Correct. What's, what's been your take on the, you know, just fucking get off your ass and do this thing versus circumstances that people can't control?

Craig: I think, um, like, honestly I've been blessed because I've worked with blokes in prison. I've worked with addicts and alcoholics who are at some of them death's door, who are in and out of incarceration. I've worked with the government. I spoke recently in Canberra with 250 leaders of government. I've spoken with— I've worked with elite athletes. I've worked with the gent— so I meet, I made a big, big cross-section of humanity. And the truth is that there's, in terms of life, there's more out of our control than in our control. And so it's our ability to be able— it's our ability largely to be okay with not being okay. And it's not, can I control everything, but can I be okay without controlling everything? And I don't want to embarrass him, but there's a friend of mine is here tonight, John, John, who has been through— and a few of you who follow me know about John's story, but— and I won't give away too much, but he got blown up in an industrial accident, literally blown up. And his family was told he'd die and told he wouldn't live. And then if he did live, which he wouldn't, but if he did, he'd be a quadriplegic and he'd be severely brain damaged. And he's, you know, and all of these things. And that was December 1st, 2017, and he's still here. And I see him 3 days a week and we do his rehab together. And gave me a fucking stern handshake at the front door. Good. And in the middle of this, dude— and I remember one day we were at the gym and we, as part of his rehab, was trying to crawl. So here's this, you'll never walk, you'll never— there should be a quadriplegic, you'll have to have all this special shit in your house and you'll, you know— and he's still got a long way to go and he's still rehabbing. But I remember looking down and he crawled from that end of the mat to that end of the mat in about 3 painful minutes. And he looked up at me like he just won a fucking Olympic gold medal, right? And he was fucking teary, and I was teary, and the Crab, my training partner, was teary. These 3 big alpha males couldn't have been fucking happier for this champion of a human crawling 3 meters, right? And then you go, oh, okay, so I have zero problems, you know. And so for me, being able to spend time with people like John and being able to work with people who— like, I've got the most privileged life ever. I have zero problems. If I ever complain about my life, any of you can punch me in the face because my life is fucking amazing. And if I have problems, I'm the problem. If I start complaining about something, the problem's me. Me. But we don't want to go, the problem's me, because we want to deflect. Because if I go, the problem's me, then I've got to step up, own up, and do something. So it's much easier to go, it's him, it's her, it's this, it's my genetics. It's— and I'm not saying people don't have legit issues, but I'm saying, and this is not very popular because I work with people with real problems, but I think a lot of the problems that we consider problems are just storeys we tell ourselves because we're precious. I'm not saying there are not people with real mental and emotional health issues. Of course there are, and they have my respect and my compassion. But when I talk to somebody whose problems are a half out of 10 and they're talking as though it's an 11 out of 10, I feel like going hang out with Johnny for a half a day and shut the fuck up.

Josh: How do you create, uh, in the moments when you've lost perspective, how do you remind— you know, your Uber Eats is late and you're ready to fucking blow up.

Craig: Yeah, yeah. Well, I think that all of this— good question. I mean, relatable. But the thing too is we are human. And do I ever lose perspective and crack the shits and feel sorry for myself? 100%. Yeah. Am I aware in the moment that I'm also being a dickhead? Yeah. But I'm in that fucking emotion. Yeah. And I'm gonna ride it. Um, but this is, this is the human experience. But I don't— like, when I fuck up, I 100% know I'm the problem. And there's a big difference between self-loathing— oh, I'm a moron, I'm a fucking idiot, no one will love— that's ridiculous. And self-awareness, which is my life is amazing and I'm being a fucking sook right now. Yeah. You know, which is awareness and it's positive.

Tommy: Are you writing these things? Like, should this be something we write down, we pull out of our pocket, or it's on our screensaver?

Craig: No, I just think if you live with an awareness of gratitude and perspective, and you every day give thanks, every day give thanks. Like, really, I know this sounds cliché, and we all go, oh, you know, just keep an attitude of gratitude, and, you know, oh, fucking let's sing Kumbaya and fucking hang out. But we don't do it. Yeah, like, we don't do it. We get caught up in bullshit, and then we're 50. You know, you have to work on you. Like, knowing these things is not applying these things. It's all about the application. It's all about— well, don't talk about meditating, meditate. Don't talk about changing the way you eat, change the fucking way you eat. Change your relationship with food. Because all this is is an hour and a half of theory. Yeah, and the theory—

Josh: theories were a bit of banter. Just— am I getting intense? Bit of light banter. Come on. And you bring up meditation, it does remind me I'm for that meditation app as well that I should start using. But anyway, how much does that cost you?

Craig: Uh, how much is it?

Josh: Uh, I think it's $15 a month or something. More than that, but it was more— I think it's a week.

Craig: You bought my audio program. Yeah, you might as well not listen to that as well.

Josh: Yeah, but it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, you know, it's a thought. Part of it's the thought, surely.

Tommy: All right, one question at least we have to have.

Josh: I don't know if I can push them on it. No, okay, great.

Tommy: Just hand the mic right over here. Just do this. Okay, here we go, here we go.

Josh: Yep. Oh, well, at least just grab them. Please take the microphone. Here we go. Hi, what's your name? Rob. Rob. Hey Rob, whereabouts are you from? Are you around here or— Mary Warren South. Mary Warren South. Yeah, you grew up— yeah, Endeavour Hills boy. It's not far. Absolutely. On the Daily Talk Show's intro, there's an Endeavour Hills homage where of the sign Anyway, that's a long story.

Tommy: Rob, why did you come tonight? Because my wife. Okay, great. And she made you take the microphone.

Craig: This is going well. Yeah, this is good, mate.

Josh: This is actually very good for our show. Yeah, this is— we've got a real-life person. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, this is Mr. 97. Yeah, which is great. I mean, what's— what stands out from you, Rob, with when you hear Craig talk? What resonates with you? I've enjoyed it.

Mason: Um, first of all. But one thing is that, you know, I'm mid-40s and I had a mission in my 40s. I thought that's the, you know, you're going to be the most productive, you're going to be in terms of your work life, you can earn the most amount of money.

Josh: You're wearing a fucking polo shirt, of course you are.

Mason: And I've got to 45.

Craig: Yeah.

Mason: And I said, I always said, you know, the last couple years are going to be selfish because we're going to do the best that we can with our family, with each other. But I can see now I've only got 5 years to go until I'm 50. How am I going to get there? Because I've given everything. We feel like we've given everything. You know, it takes a lot of energy to run a business, to look after people. Yeah. And you're doing it for them and you're doing it for yourself. But you got to, you know, set some goals and you've got to keep motivated and keep working at it. It's hard. Yeah. It's hard to keep going.

Josh: Is the ambition thing is It seems like there is— and thanks, Rob, for having the question or the statement— that idea of ambition and that idea of the only way that I'm going to do this is stop fucking telling myself these storeys and just do it. And the relentlessness, how can we balance that with that kumbaya Chill out. Gratitude.

Craig: It's Rob, right? Rob said, so how will I get there? You're there. Like, the only moment you're ever going to live is this moment. Like, you're never going to live— like, when the future comes around, it won't be the future, it'll just be another instalment of now. And it's not to say we shouldn't plan for what we call the future, but it also means that right now, in this moment— so we, us 25 people in this room, will never have this experience again. They'll never be these 25. That bad. But I'm just saying, having that awareness of this experience in this moment, like, for me, I'm— there's nothing in my head except this moment and trying to be good for these people and trying to be whatever we need here, but also enjoying the moment. And so you also have to acknowledge what's awesome about your life and what you're doing great and what's your emotional bank balance and your spiritual bank balance and what's great about You know, imagine if you— what, perish the thought, not going to happen— but all of a sudden someone very close to you, something happened tomorrow, then all you would want is today back where that thing hadn't happened. So that doesn't mean don't plan, don't be ambitious, but it all also means don't waste energy on stuff that today you can't change, you know. Because like what, what we have, I believe most people are living in something that is really truly a gift but we don't have the level of awareness around how valuable it is until it's ripped away from us. And I know that seems deep and philosophical, but like, I just think we live in such an amazing time, such amazing resources. Australia is, in my opinion, the best country in the world for a range of reasons. There are other beautiful countries, but I just think we're privileged.

Josh: I mean, where have you felt that you've had wasted energy where you look back?

Craig: Wasted my insecurity, my ego, my bullshit, where I've just wasted time looking for approval and being selfish. And, and I realise that, and I acknowledge that, and I can still have fun around that. But where I realise my purpose is not to build me up, it's to build others up. And I know that sounds deep and philosophical, but I truly believe that. And the more that— the more selfish I am, the worse I am. And you'll never meet someone who's selfish and happy. Yeah, you won't. Yeah, it just doesn't happen.

Josh: Yeah, it's misaligned. Yeah, well, we appreciate the fact that you, uh, you know, give time to us two gronks who have this small silly podcast and would let us do this.

Craig: And amazing podcast in front of your people.

Tommy: Um, what's next?

Craig: Um, well, that 12-inch penis thing that, um, look at my surgical options. And, um, because I've got an innie, which is, um, yeah.

Josh: I thought they were gonna have to actually cut off. I thought I'd just fucking break the seriousness.

Craig: Uh, what's coming up is I'm writing a book at the moment. Another one. Another one. I'm writing another book at the moment with the help, the help of a research assistant who will remain nameless, uh, on, um, just in case it goes pear-shaped.

Tommy: Yes.

Craig: On mental toughness and resilience. Yeah. And yeah, just more, more of the same. I mean, it's like you with the podcast. I'm always trying to figure out how to— sorry, how do we do workshops and half days and full days in a way which resonates? And what's the best format? And what's the best, what's the best model to create the most connection? You know, so this Sunday or Saturday, Sunday, I'm in Brisbane doing a full day on Sunday.

Tommy: Um, does it get easier, right, writing these books?

Craig: Writing the books? Yeah. Um, as long as you know what you want to write, like, as long as you've got clarity. This is actually not an easy book to write because it's quite— 20 Questions was easy because it's such— it's so big, so broad. Whereas Mental Toughness and Resilience, which I think everyone— not everyone, a lot of people need more of and it's not about being gung-ho or macho. It's about just being able to step into your fear and, and control it rather than being controlled by it, or at least manage it. Um, so yeah, it does. It gets— and, and also trying to not write a book for the sake of writing a book. Like, does this need to be written? And if it's no, then, you know, like, I like writing things that I like writing books for people who don't read books, so stuff that's a bit deep and philosophical but also overwhelmingly understandable and useful.

Tommy: You might get your dad on the 15th book.

Craig: I might. You may get him to read it. I might, yeah.

Josh: It's The Daily Talk Show. Thanks everyone for coming. It's been awesome and great flexing this muscle, which is being in a room with more than 3 people doing a podcast.

Craig: Thanks boys. Thanks everyone. Thank you.

Tommy: Hi@thedailytalkshow.com if you want to send us an email.

Josh: Otherwise, we do this every weekday.

Tommy: Craighaber.net if you want to buy a book or a lot of books, or 50.

Craig: More importantly, book me for a corporate gig.

Tommy: Yep, he'll throw in a book. See you tomorrow, guys. Bye.